Wednesday, May 21, 2008
Adobe Refuses To Say I'm Wrong
In the above video, Kevin Towes, The Product Manager for Flash Media Server is asked by Andy Plesser at Beet.tv about my comments regarding the p2p capabilities of Flash and the impact on CDNs.
While Andy interprets Kevin's answer as being a refutation of what I said, it is clearly not. Kevin actually doesn't give a direct answer. He says "Hank makes some gross assumptions in all his diligence, its sort of interesting. But what we announced is something called RTMFP." But what he does not say is, "you will not be able to make a p2p network with Flash." Also, neither has the Flash Player Product Manager Justin Everett-Church been categorical about it here or here.
I have been wrong before. I will be wrong again. And it is certainly possible that Adobe has placed some artificial barriers that make it impossible to build a p2p network with their RTMFP protocol. I have discussed some of those here. But if I am wrong, it is just really strange to me that no one in the company will come out and say it.
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8 comments:
Hi Hank- Clearly RTMFP enables the creation of all sorts of p2p insanity, but there are limitations with the current iteration of the ActionScript API.
For example, RTMFP is enabled through NetStream. I have no idea how you would ever create a reliable connection with NetStream. As such, you can't make range requests, and you can't transfer *files* via p2p. The loading and saving FileReference is also a hindrance -- you have to load and save whole files, and a dialog pops up each time. I've gone into more details here:
http://adamfisk.wordpress.com/2008/05/21/p2p-in-flash-10-beta-the-questions-facing-a-youtube-skype-and-bittorrent-killer/
While the underlying technology is there in RTMFP, the APIs and usability details don't appear to be.
Scrap my NetStream comment above. While I haven't tested it, it looks like you can actually send reliable data with NetStream's send command. You'd have to get really creative with the APIs, but the tools *just might* be there even with this Flash version.
Hi Hank, I don't know the internals of the Player or Media Server teams, and so can't comment directly.
But I do know that online it's hard to prove a negative... hard to state categorically that something is not possible. It would be easier for you to build a mockup to prove your point, than for others to prove that such a mockup could never be built.
I do know that the way your headline was phrased on the first day, and the subsequent notice it received, did tend to freak out a number of partners, and suspect that this is the larger reality which Justin and Kevin are addressing.
Sorry I don't have much, but the above is what I've got. Useful...?
jd/adobe
John,
As always, thanks.
I fully understand, and it is as I suspected. I also understand that while I am almost always supportive of Adobe, there will be times when my world view is not in line with adobe perceived corporate interests.
That said, I actually think that, partners notwithstanding, there is much more "in it" for adobe than corporate may see. Enabling powerful p2p functionality (not for stealing) would really put adobe in a powerful place. The press on this was incredibly positive if not comfortable from a corporate perspective. I am a crusader against piracy and so am not thinking of p2p in that way. But all of the worlds CDNs can serve about 1 nielsen rating point. So in order for the internet to become like TV, p2p is required. Adobe should be the company to enable that. That is what I would like to see. Adobe *can* monetize that through FMS as a coordinator as it is currently planning.
"I fully understand, and it is as I suspected. I also understand that while I am almost always supportive of Adobe, there will be times when my world view is not in line with adobe perceived corporate interests."
True, that. But you're confident that you can make your best case, and that it will be heard and understood inside Adobe, right?
Similar vein, have you had a chance to watch Colin Moock interview Jim Corbett of the Player team? I didn't expect to watch the whole 50 minutes, but I did. Think you'll like it. ;-)
jd/adobe
Justin just put up a FAQ:
http://justin.everett-church.com/index.php/2008/05/23/astrop2p/
adobe anounced RTMFP in May, but the FMS and AS4 are NOT yet available.
who can make use of RTMFP without FMS / AS4?
adobe is wasting her time ...too bad ..;-(
adobe is wasting our time ...
any one knows, RTMFP without AS4/FMS = ?
may be, just a "JOKE" from adobe.
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